I Guess We Were Supposed To Sell ATI...

I guess this was the post Cramer sell-off this morning. Do you remeber the study I talked about on my "I Hate Jim Kramer post?" I still talk to a few fund managers that believe and actively participate in the "Post Khraymer Depression" theory. I am going to try and hold back the expletives throughout this post... I won't guarantee anything, but I will really try. I really hate to see a good winner die.

I saw a few comments flying around about SMG this morning. I can't believe it finally broke. For all the Master Talk participants that took this trade after our meeting a couple weeks ago, congrats! It took forever, but we knew it was coming!

I'll be back after I find a way to vent.

P.S. I spell Kramer (Craymer, Kraimer, Chraiyhmer) wrong for personal resons. Don't ask.

The Jan 55 calls on SMG aren't doing much this morning. 70 cent bid/ask spread. Ouch.

But at least now I'm break even.

Ouch on NUE.


I took SMG this morning on the break. Hope I'm not too late.

I exited ATI yesterday. The trading gods were watching over me....for a change. But I see a new entry coming soon.


Jeff - Here's a question from a relatively new trader: I had pushed my stop limit on ATI all the way up to $12 (on Jan 85's). It opened below that at about $11.40. Should my options been sold at that opening price? The stop limit order is still sitting there in my account and says "working".

John M.

John, a stop limit means that if the option drops to $12 it should be sold at a price no lower than $12 (the downside limit). If you had a simple stop order in place, it sells at the current market price as soon as the option is below $12. If the option opens at $5 the next morning, the limit order will prevent the sale (price is below $12), but a market order would have triggered at $5.

The challenge is the gap at the opening. Since options only get sold during market hours, the first price is based on whatever happens with the stock overnight so it is very difficult to guage. I knew when I got up that ATI was in trouble (based on after hours trading) but there was nothing to be done in terms of the limit orders in place.

One of the tough lessons of options trading! Aargh.


Jon - Thanks - I was afraid that was the case with the gap between closing yesterday and opening this morning. Just curious where I can go to see after hours trading? I might have done something different if I had seen this coming.

John M.

I just got stopped out of WYNN. I did hold some of my profit.

John M.

It's an interesting mindset we develop as traders. I entered all the information on my WYNN trade into my spreadsheet, and my reaction was "Crap - I only made 17.2%" - that was for 7 days. A lot of people with saving accounts would be happy to make that in 3 years.

John M.

Hoping this is just a pre-FED sell off and we get a pop this afternoon.

My trailing stop on ATI was triggered at 95.68, I was happy with an 83% return though.

My AAPL Jan 90 calls were doing well yesterday...

Cheers, Lejon

John, I check afterhours action each morning pre-market open at finance.yahoo.com for each of my holdings to get an idea of where things will be. Hope this helps.


I was just thinking the same thing - WYNN wasn't so bad at 28% and we'd already made a nice 200% on the first trade - we still like WYNN. We're also liking VTS a lot at the moment!

Just keep those stop orders nice and tight and it won't hurt so much when things go wrong! Good luck with your trading!

Teri M.

Just curious, I'm not hoping, but is a triggered stop any intra day touch of your stop price or do some people waite for the bulls at 3pm to rescue the position so the close is on the trend line, while the low for the day could be below the line?

Not a good day !

Brian K

closed the ATI call and took a very small put position. So far so good

John - Thanks for the info. Do you find that trading the following day usually follows closely what happens in after hours trading, or is it the other way around?

John M.

Grrr... meetings all day. I hate finding out at the end of the day want went well or wrong and missing a trade.

XOM, support bounce today. Hope to get in tomorrow.


John and Teri,
I agree about Wynn. Besides, this bull flag still has about $16 to run, I think. I went in to look at VTS and typed VTI instead. It's on a real tear right now and is just heading back to support. Looks like in about 3 or 4 days, it could be a good buy.
I've still got $100 profit in ATI. I'm sure tomorrow will take care of that. I was out of town today and got back too late to sell. Somebody ply Jeff with alchohol and find out his beef with Cramer. Sounds like a really good story.

Chris and Catherine

also was away from the computer most of the day and did not get out of ATI, i am still up 20% or so but man OUCH!!!Hold the Jan calls so am now wondering if it is worth holding tomorrow to see if it bounces. td

I have said for awile that Cramer can be the death to a stock, but have just been watching him closely the past week or two. The market does seem to jump when he talks about it. But then tanks in a week or two. I cringe when I hear people say something like "I took the trade on your recommendation" on his show. You have given good trades on the blog, that I have looked at and thumbed my nose at. I either didn't see what you saw, or worse I saw something that turned me off to the trade.

How can poeple put their $$ on the line without giving it a thought. I don't mind losing $$ as long as it was my call and it was wrong. Visa Versa, while making $$ on someone elses call is good on the account it sucks not knowing what is going on.

In the New Market Wizards they talk about if what got you in the trade breaks down do you stay in. The comment back was no, if the position is making $$ but I don't know why you need to get out before getting hurt.

I am learning more each day, today I learned that ATI fell all day. Damn, I did get out about 2 PM when the market went up and ATI bearly budged

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About me

  • I'm Option Addict
  • From Saratoga Springs, Utah, United States
  • I am a professional trader and an instructor for Investools. I've had relations with the markets for 9 years. Born in Concord, CA, but reside in Saratoga Springs, Utah. Father of THREE, Husband of one.
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