Is That a VIX on Your Chart...Or Are You Happy To See Me?

The market moves over 2%. Was it a direction that made you money? Check out the action on the VIX today. We tackled some pretty significant territory during the day, but check out what we have done on the longer term chart....

Take a look at the significance of the action we saw in the VIX on the longer term chart. Notice how we are rapidly approaching a historical mean. A break into the mid 20's here makes this a whole new ball game. This is my reasoning for moving into more spread trades. Even though I am not totally fond of the strategy, the market is pricing in a lot more risk than it has in the past. Plus, with credit policies tightening all over, it's going to be tough to finance your options, unless you sell options to reduce your costs.

Speaking of tightening credit policies, the market is finally starting to feel the impact of the sub-prime and housing disasters. Bad news is, it isn't getting any better. Have you looked at the Homebuilder ETF?

This is a major breakdown. There is not a bid for these stocks in sight, and like we've been discussing, don't be surprised to see some bankruptcies in this group. Make sure you are getting in on this action if you missed this idea from earlier in the week.

Finally, the bottom that we called in the Yen was uncanny. Use this ETF as a measurement of liquidity... if the Yen strengthens, stocks head lower. Better yet, use this as a hedge against a market correction.

Since I am here at 9 p.m. at night, the global markets are pricing in the panic that was seen in US markets, take a look at the Hang Seng...

Make sure you understand what is going on here. There is a change going on in this market. As indicated by the VIX, a change is expected, but there is no telling how little or how much. Don't be a hero here, or emotionally charged to do something you shouldn't. Most of the readers here have only experienced a bull market. Don't expect the market to do what it is that you are used to. Put yourself in a position where you can be profitable regardless (diversify).

This post has focused on the negatives, but the major positive here is that earnings are still strong. According to corporate profits, the market is trading at a discount. However, rather than to run out there to try and catch a falling knife, play defensively and keep your stops tight. Let things cool off perhaps before trying to buy things "on sale."

Even though days like this are typically a downer (for the sake of others), I am pretty happy with the e-mails that I am getting. Most traders are pretty well diversified from the ideas I have pitched, and the majority made money today. On the other hand, it is times like this where the market has caught some of us doing something we shouldn't have been doing. Perhaps we were overtrading? Not properly positioned, too much exposure, risk, etc. It is times like this where a lot of traders drop out or decide that trading isn't for them. I understand why, because I have been faced with that choice a number of times in my career.

Trading will have ups and downs, high points and low points, and profits and losses. Just know that becoming a successful trader is something that can be accomplished, but it won't happen overnight. If you have a strong desire to do this, know that it is possible. I have been given some great tools (Marketcast, Mastertalk, etc) and have been able to slowly make a correction and major changes to how and what people are learning about trading. If you feel like you still are not there yet, stick with me. If you've read this blog long enough, you see that differences are made, people graduate, and are getting better at this everyday. You can too, if it is something you really want to do.

I'm spent. See you tomorrow.

I was actually up 5% today.

Wouldn't have done it without your advice and trading guidelines Jeff.
Appreciate everything your doing, for me, and everyone else.

I am only 19 years old...


Even though I did a few stupid things today (on purpose) my portfolio is still up. So, even though I've lost money recently it was unrealized gains and overall I'm still up from the initial money we put into our account (though not by much). So, it could be a lot worse and if it wasn't for all that you do with IT and here on this blog (along with all the other option addicts) I wouldn't be in this great position right now. Though, at the moment I feel like I'm going to be taking another crash course through market craziness but I'm strapped in and ready for the ride. I just hope I don't throw up first. ;-)

Thanks again. And thanks for the re-recording of Master's Talk. I realized some more about my trading and some things I definitely need to correct.


Thanks for the late night post....i figured i would check it one more time before making bottles and heading to bed....i was feeling a little like i was going to miss something, by not buying discounted calls today on our trades that pulled back....i just had a feeling to let it cool off for a few days....i feel better about that decision after reading your post....

thanks for the advice Dave...i reread my post and noticed i wrote should have said call....i am only in it for $210....i thought it was worth the gamble.....if i lose it all, i will consider it a night out on the town.

Bob....will you send jeff a pic of these cabinets ??? so we can all see your handy work....i would like to see them (or send me a pic, if you still have my email address)

congrats to all who made some bank today (esp to the 19 yr old who has no name, great job!!)....i did not, but i am still up for the month....i feel like i owe a big thank you to this blog, my trading has came a long long way since feb 27th.....the one major bummer is if i would not have held COL, CRDN, and ESRX over earnings i would have been up about 6% today.....i guess i should have asked jeff and eric if i should hold over earnings.....

hey maybe the 19 yr old is the phantom poet.....hhmmmmm
where is C2???

I, too, was down 50% of my initial account beginning 1 1-2 years ago. Since this blog about 4 months ago, I have gained back all that was lost plus a little extra. It is because of Jeff and all you who help and encourage each other daily. I was up 10% today! I just keep on learning and from all the great people here!
In the past, I would have paniced and sold at the absolute wrong time. I am much better at looking at the whole picture and following trading rules that I am still working on.
Thanks so much,


I just almost POOPED my pants!!!

Seriously....Investools sight says TOL up $27.46 after hrs and CNX up $20.58 for the day !!! i think i saw stars for a minute...then i remembered someone earlier said IT was not working....thank you yahoo finance
They really need to get there act together....that could give someone a stroke, esp after aday like today....

ok it is 12:30, time to go to bed...have a good day tomorrow....i will check in tomorrow night (i hope michelle comes back)


Thanks for showing us your charts. I look at these charts every day ... and I don't see what you do ... but I'm getting better. I can't believe I just looked at the VIX and didn't see it!

Thanks to you, the blog, and the Marketcast I can sleep tonight.



Great post and a needed pep talk. I was actually up today but mainly because I closed out a number of trades in the prior 2 days. I had Crox and LEN which kept me in the pink. I closed my other trades for 2 reasons. One, your prior posts were suggesting caution and...I was going on vacation. So, I did well today for reasons that do not reflect on my skills as a trader. I needed some down time and because of that, I benefited. Go figure!! I truly value this blog, and value your input. My thoughts are with Michelle and I know it must be hard for you to lose a fellow blogster but my guess is she will find a way back if you are still willing to provide this format. Jeff, please do what you do to keep us engaged. I think that many of us would have quit trading without this venue. I know that I would have. You know how to pay it forward. It will come back to you and your family.

Just a tip,

The anonymous 19 year old and C2 are not the Phantom Poet because It is I.

thanks Jeff, really appreciate the perspective you give. You're right about there being some great positives. I lucked out and was in the OI trade. Up 15% today. Not too many stocks did that :)

Thanks as always,


If you end up reading this first... I wrote you on the last thread close to the end.

Okay, I'm going to take a moment. All the kids are finally asleep. And today was exhausting. I was even distracted during kick boxing. Anyway, I hope you all have a great night. Talk to you all tomorrow.


Thank you so much for re-recording the MT session. I listened to it just now each time you go over exits, I 'get it' a little more. I'm still working on taking smaller and smaller losses which has been a big problem for me in the past.

Your commitment to helping us become better traders is awesome and so appreciated.


Just found time to read your post.

Invaluable lesson. And amidst the time you spend trading and researching all day long (it IS MORE than a full time job in terms of emotion and energy drain), you still find time to share both your wisdom and your emotion with us.

It is very much appreciated buddy.

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Thanks for taking the time and effort to share some of your lessons learned with us. It really is appreciated.

Thanks for all you do for us. You have done an awesome job of helping to build a community of great people on their way to becoming good traders. Your advice and commitment to helping us are a sign of a man with great character.

Now it's time to roll up the sleeves, be smart and protect the money first and maybe make a little second.


You asked in the last post about why some of us held onto DECK. I thought I'd answer it because it's a good question, and a follow up to the email that I sent Jeff which he posted here a couple of weeks ago.
I entered DECK on 6/7/07 with an ITM Sept 80 Call. I only bought one because it fell within my money management rules which are to not enter a position greater than 2% of my account.
Of course I'd been in previously for a great gain, so my YTD gains could afford a small loss on this to see if it broke longer term support at 95. Technically, I stayed in because in the last two days with the market as down as it's been, there has been late-in-he-day buying in DECK pushing it to or above it's area of support. If you draw horizontal lines, each close on each down day was near an area of support.
Now, the rules I use are pretty simple. I'm not over-invested, so I don't have much to lose, and the candles are telling me a story.
Honestly, i didn't know earnings were last night, and the bump up this morning is a pleasant surprise. Keeping track of earnings was too much for me to do, so I've made my system as stupid-proof as possible for me. If I'm not risking much, I can't lose much, and if I take a longer term approach I can be patient through some movement down.
Now what I'm looking for is a lower high. If I get one, I'm out. As long as we stay in an uptrend, I'm in.
PCAR, though is a different story. I saw it drop like a rock through support and I exited at the end of the day because i waited, but I had been in it since March 29th, and it was an AUG 60 call. I still made 40% on it. AND I had sold calls against it in the past, so my net gains were higher.
My rules are still a bit foggy. I'm not sure anyone could pick up my trades and continue them if I wasn't around, and the cabinet analogy has been percolating with me. I understand more and more every day why it needs to be clear why I trade what I trade and how. I'm just not sure I can put it down on paper. It seems so intuitive.

Hope this is helpful.

Jeff, Thanks for sharing exspecially on your quality time.I also trac housing with the Index $HGT.
My New Mantra! Be Right! or Be Right Out! That's about poetic as I get!

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Phantom Poet,

Good morning fine sir
I wish you well
A pleasure to battle
And i wish you well

You are a friend indeed
all kidding aside
but I am getting close
to where you reside

you have taken the bait
to my trap your not hip
and closing in
none other than Chip

I just wanted to say thank you. You are a constant here on this blog. Your words of advice and perspective on trading have been invaluable to me. I agree totally with Ramio. It is not always easy to take the time to share like you have. What you said on your last post struck home. I wanted you to know what a difference you have made to me personally in my trading. Thank you for sharing.

I was also searching last the last couple of days. I came across SIGM. See if you like it once it breaks above its flag


Long time reader, first time commenter.

Jeff, Thanks for being the voicew of reason and calm in a crazy day on the market.

This blog has been invaluable to me, as well as the Marketcast. Thanks again.


CROX is looking fantastic in premarket.

Brett - what are your thoughts on position sizing with puts for hedging? I've thought about using OTM puts and sizing the position based on total loss, but have not (unfortunately for yesterday) done so.

Jeff - for hedging w/ FXY, it seems we would not wait for an actual setup - but just go ahead and get in when you want to hedge against potential correction. Does that sound accurate?


Check out boom today, breaking out nicely today.

James H.

BOOM even!

James H.

BLUD is moving today. They reported great earnings yesterday, but the market put a damper on things.

Anybody have any good put plays close to a support level?

Liz and Lisa thanks!

Lisa I understand your rules, I think, and why you stayed in. You have been in the trade longer so you had a different support. I was in stock so looked at it more long term but when my support was broken I was stopped out.

Liz, I did see your posts but was not on the blog last night when you wrote them, thanks.

Only in three trades right now: HCP, PCP and GMCR but GMCR may be exited today. Thanks Jeff and Benton for those of us that did not make the call for MCK, MRX and AHS. Not sure if I will take them as I am unsure of the market and have limited time.

Yes, I will see if I can send a picture of these cabinets but probably will not show the detail that was put into them by my Dad. I still think it strange that we can find trading wisdom in all parts of our lives. So sorry we do not see Michelle here anymore.

Hey, I am UP $89.50 not YHOO just excitement!

check out SIGM it is breaking out and so far volume is good. It held its own during the recent bearish activity and now it is heading higher. Its industry group is also going from red to yellow.

Anyone see a entry coming in POT? I know I am not supposed to fall in love with a stock but look at it battling it's way back up. Based on all my reading stocks that handle down markets well are stocks to be in.
Also I was reading Lessons from the Greatest Stock Traders of all time last night and all make a point of NOT using diversification. Here is a quote "...they all believed that the most profits could be made in diversifying as little as possible, and they proved this by making millions." Doesn't appear to line up with my IT education what am I missing?

Hello all,

Am I crazy? i am holding crox because it hasn't hit my target yet?

Also nice break to the downside if you can get some affordable puts. In the utilities right here in Idaho.

Short -IDA
Long - Rubber Shoes


Another fine piece of prose.

You will get if by nothing else, trough process of elimination.


This market has been all over the place this morning, but I guess that was expected.

EEM is down. GLD and SLV are down. TNX has been up and down but it looks like it's trying to climb back up (at the time I'm writing this) and the VIX is back up.


I can feel for Michelle.
My wife is not a risk taker in investing or life. She does keep me in check as I do take risks so it helps temper me.
I have been trading since May 06. My first trade ever returned 110%. One contract that I bought for $300 bucks. When I excitedly told her these results her first question was why I didn't have more invested in this trade! UHHHH!
Well guess what I did? I took on a larger postions and got killed rather then stay with my own plan. My account was down 40% at the low point. All the while taking grief from my wife. Since Febuary I have made all of this back. This also coincides with attending the Investools 3 day school in February which was extremely helpful.
I made it through the 2/27 correction and this week's as well.
I will succed at this and know I'm getting better all the time.

I did tell my wife that it would be more enjoyable to work hard at this to prove her right rather then prove her wrong. This seemed to strike a cord with her....
Thanks for listening everyone!

PS:I caught MCK this morning for the perfect entry!


You are all my heros doing battle with the market under the watchful eye of General Jeff. I was fortunate to be in the black yesterday mostly due to my put portfolio. My long winners such as AAPL and BIDU were balanced out by losers such as CRS and JOYG. Then again, maybe it was my lucky Option Addict golf shirt I was wearing that protected me from the slings and arrows of the market gods!
Stan Lake
Short LAZ
P.S. How, where do I go to set up an account with my name instead of hiding in the shadows of anonymity?

Great posts on the boards here lately. Thanks Jeff. Thanks all.

CTX at potential entry point. Though homebuilders were peculiarly stable yesterday. I listened to their earnings conference call (First time ever doing that, and it was a great experience. It's amazing what you can hear between the lines). Their call was not inspiring to say the least.

Bob, I've been watching POT again too. Looks to me though that it has to get above the high on 7/2 again before I'm seriously interested.


I think with a lot of learning you build a base and from there you jump off in the direction that feels like it's right for you. For example, look at DECK and the reasons Lisa and I stayed in the trade. Purely different reasons and obviously we had our lines drawn differently. She saw something very different on the chart than I saw but it worked for us both.

I think it's the same with woodworking. You have the same tools but every craftsman approaches his project with a different eye and may even use some of the tools differently than really intended but he's made it his own and it works for him.

And as far as POT. It's a really good strong solid stock. It seems to move fairly consistently and even though it may get pulled down during down days in the broad market it doesn't seem to affect it as much as some of the other stocks. Now, of course, everything could change tomorrow but this has been what it's shown in the past on the chart. And I believe it's pretty easy to set exits on this stock as well because of it's consistency.


Never mind my question on how to get an account, I stumbled onto the answer.

Anyone here riding the CROX rocket today? Woo-Hoo!

CTX - I got in the trade on the spike up day before yesterday. I didn't take profits yesterday morning like I should have. I say this because: 1. it was a big move and I had a pretty good profit; 2. I had noticed some pretty big lots being bought (28,000 shares was the largest single block) and 3. This stock trended up all day yesterday. Then this morning, I saw an article where Cramer (I just love this guy, NOT!) came out and said there was no need to sell CTX but the rest of the homebuilders you could.

So I did take my profits this morning and I am glad to be rid of it. That's my .02 for what its worth.


Last night on the Marketcast Jeff mentioned NOT to trade the VIX. Could someone please explain why?


I like the analysis Scoot. Your post reminds me not to be afraid to take profits earlier than I normally would in less volatile markets.

And, I haven't been accustomed to watching the lot sizes on trades but it is something I need to start factoring in as well.

And Cramer, well, no comment.


Right On Liz. That's why technical analysis is an artform, not a science.

And in the end Bob, you followed your rules, so we all win.

Remember, the success of a trade is not whether you profit or lose on a trade, but whether or not you follow your rules.

I know I don't follow my rules, so I had to make sure I protected my account from myself... That's why my positions have remained so small. but with each passing month, I follow them more and more. I'm on the right track.

Anybody got any good bearish trades that are close to support?

Got up early and greated the sun
went to my computer to have some fun,
pulled up my charts, looked at the VIX,
and then I saw it, it made me sick,
another poem from Raimo, he writes so many,
and compliments from Arty, have I gotten any?
so I ignored my trades and put pen to paper,
I will not allow my responses to taper,
Chip and Raimo, you will not uncover,
my real name because I have discovered,
that you posture and threaten and blow hot air,
from multiple orifices, which one I don't care,
and in the end I still am unknown
because I refuse to be dethroned,
as the Phantom Poet that you seek
have a great weekend,do it again next week??

Trading the VIX is suicide. It is like playing every hand in a no limit hold em' game.


i got up to put the dog out, and when i came back grmn was down 4. whats that all about. Im still fighting with my rules of how long to wait before I think the trade has gone the wrong way intra day and to get out, instead of waiting till close to see if there is a reversal

long island ny

Jeez, GRMN just fell off a cliff.

James H.


Thanks for the explanation. Jeff's comment was very timely. I was looking at the trading the VIX prior to listenting to the Marketcast.



I'm glad that Jeff and Eric talked about trading the VIX on last night's Marketcast as well because my husband was just talking about how he wanted to trade the VIX and I kept telling him it was a bad idea.



very nice!,,we all love your banter back and forth with Raimo


gh -

One technique that you can use is an intraday chart. I will use a 5 minute and an hourly chart and after 10:00 ET, I will wait for the trend to show itself and base my decision on that. The reason I use 2 time frames is the longer one is used to get a better idea of what the trend really is and then the shorter time frame can be used to better time the entry/exit and see different levels of S/R. If you play around with diffeent time frames you might find something that works for you.


Take a look at AA. It's right at it's support level. Break below 37.50 or so to the fill the gap back to at least around 35 and possibly right back to 32.50 (looking at 5 year chart but even going to the 10 year chart). Someone earlier was looking for put plays near a level of support. But with the VIX so high, I don't know.


I was throwing up from my roller coaster rides om CROX and GRMN today. Sorry about not giving you the shout out you clearly desrve on two fronts.

You rhythmic prose, and sustaining you anonymity while driving Raimo crazy.

Your 8 Mile style battling has been killing me over here. You stick with I am sure the real Slim Shady will stand up one day!


Hi all,

CSH looks like low risk bearish entry

This hasn't worked in weeks, and I have no expectations of it working today, but i'm going to get a burrito. Strap yourselves in, perhaps for the last time.

Thank you Sue and Arty, I can leave for my long weekend now knowing Raimo has to make the next move.



Maybe a couple white mochas while you're at it?


Sorry Brett, I went to town Tues. and went to CMG for lunch. We don't do it very often as we live out of town. But I think that is what made the markets tank. I'm sure you will have the calming effect in the down swing and make everything alright again. Next time I go to CMG, I will alert everyone before hand so they can tighten stops.

I think WCG is at a good entry or add position.

Earnings Aug 1 though...


Good day,
What a week!!! I have been away from the computer way too much and now I can't get my head around most of the trades that I have, so I'm bailing on almost all of them. DECK came back nicely today, so I'm out with a nice profit. GRMN seems to have discovered that gravity really DOES suck, so I'm out with a very hefty profit. PCU seems to have found that all that glitters is not copper so I'm out with a hefty profit.

The great thing about the last week is that I still have only one stock that I've lost money on. Yes... I've lost about $4,000 in unrealized gains (about 10%) but that has opened a whole new page of my education. Perhaps there is a time to take profits. I will gather all my children around the campfire and regail them with stories of stocks sold, stocks not sold, and stocks that should have been sold, then were sold... then shouldn't have been sold. They will cry tears of joy, then tears of sorrow. But in the end we're still here and my head, although it has exploded once this week (and Catherine had to clean it up and reassemble it) is firmly back on my shoulders and functional.

I have sold almost everything we have at the moment and I'm taking a breather. The market has me perplexed and that's not a healthy frame of mind to be trading in. I am going to start re-evaluating all new entries and hope to come up with a new list that is as succesfull as the last list was. I know it's not the best way to trade, but I need the breather and then a fresh start.

I have missed many of the last posts and will try to catch up on the weekend. I have missed you all horribly this past week, and can't wait to get back in the saddle next week.

Cheers for the winners, tears for the losers, and warm hugs to all who continue to contribute (and those who have taken a break, too.) It is a truly unique society we have here and we are all lucky to be a part of it.


"We are hard pressed on every side, but not crushed; perplexed, but not in despair; persecuted, but not adandoned; struck down, but not destroyed."

Thought that would be a timely quote.

Good news, yesterday was an ugly day for me personally and for those in the market. My husband and I worked things out. I am going to trade SMALL stock positions that are low-risk. I am going to balance out my trading and spend some more time with my kids and not watching quotes all day. And since I was not in the market yesterday (except three small positions), I wasn't affected by the market tank.
I thank you all for your prayers and uplifting comments. Hope years from now, I can look back on this time and just laugh.

God Bless and let's all hang in there. Things always change (the market included.)


Taking profits versus letting winners run.

Okay, here is my take on this since I have been on both sides of this dilemma.

First, I always have a target price for my trade. Once that target is reached, the I let this winner run, or take my profits?

FOR ME, that depends on two things...what the chart tells me (new support/resistant lines and a re-evaluatin of the trade), and, how much time is left on my option. If I have enough time left for a bounce lower and than a bounce higher, I take at least half of the table (pocket the profits)and let the rest run. If I do not have enough time left for a bounce lower, than higher, I take it all. I apply this rule of mine to both calls and puts.

Just sharing one of my rules....

Logging in from a random computer at my office where I seem to be stuck instead of at my World Headquarters where I can really watch the markets and trade.

What I noticed early this morning as the market opened and I was getting ready to leave....
- Lots of stocks looking like good entries due to yesterday's swan dive (POT for one)
- Almost nothing in my portfolio that can go either up or down since I am out of almost everything except 1 AIV and 2 CAH puts. And some small stock positions.

I'm finding it increasingly difficult to trade successfully while I'm running around trying to earn a living (too busy earning a living to make any real money). Not ready to give up real estate because I'm not good enough at trading yet. Frustrating. I have been steadily recouping last years losses and am almost back to even, including this week's minor losses but I still find it frustrating.

Gonna bang the hell out of those drums tonight. Thanks for letting me vent.

Now back to your regular scheduled stock picking...

Thoughts on NVDA as swing trade between now and earnings? Today's bounce is still holding up.

There are plusses and minuses to trading the VIX. On the plus side, on average the VIX has risen 16.8% on days when the SPX fell 3% or more. That makes it a good method of diversification as insurance and a hedge against market disaster. The VIX cannot go to zero, it trades in a range and with its high volatility it offers some good trading opportunities. You can trade directionally or spread trades like any other option.

Although Jeff didn't go into why he is against trading the VIX it might have to do with the fact that thee value of options is not direct from the spot price of the VIX but is based on the forward value using current and next month options. Next month options on the VIX have lower volatility than the spot VIX (about half) so you can think you are making money if you look at the current price when you are really down. So instead of confusing his listeners and bloggers it's easier just to warn us away.

Thanks for sharing, man. Right now my taking profits is my really weak point, and I'm going to go back and analyse all my past exits and see what worked and what didn't. I sold DECK earlier and I see it's continuing to rise. Missed out on at least another $2 in profits but took my 150% profit to the cashier's desk and will be happy with it for now. I've printed your post and will look at it again, and try to assemble my own exit rules. I feel really comfortable with my entry rules... these damn exit ones are driving me nuts.

NVDA was another stock I was looking at but I am not buying anytthing today. Nada. Going to spend some time over the weekend searching my watchlists where I know there are a ton of trades waiting.

Interesting how so many of us have come to similar conclusions and are mostly out of the market now.

Okay Phantom take it easy big guy
The VIX I see is going sky high

Study the chart and mark the trend
A rally lets hope at the days end

As for your latest ryhming creation
Sounded like a bit of frustration

Trying to ID you is not really my job
As for your first name we know it is ___

Back to my charts and making some money
I hope your next poem is really funny

For the rest of the bloggers do you see what i see
In a down market check out CME

And showing some Hutspa my old friend GOOGle
but taking it now just might not be froogle

Time to look for more trades showing some bling
then off for the weekend, yup, a yuengling....


anyone else take it down?

VSEA...rock it like Chicago Stadium.

Bob and Brett,

What the hell are you guys doing getting into CME and VSEA today?

Can I get a look onto these crystal balls?

I could see if you were already in something like HIG.

Can you oracles elaborate?


I give raimo full credit for CME. i've been loading up the past 2 days. Great call, Raimo.

VSEA is just a nice handle breakout.


I attended a training seminar last year held by the CBOE and the instructor explained how the VIX options are priced. Suffice it to say it is not a great trading vehicle as they are not based upon the day to day movement of the vix but on futures settlement.

The CBOE instructor actively discouraged the class from trading the VIX Options, unless you really can follow how they move.

Glad you were with me Brett....

I took down VSEA, thank you..


Brett, Raimo,

Can you remind me what the difference is in the options on VSEA with the same strike price? I don't want to buy into the wrong one. Thanks


Options of the same strike are usually from corporate actions... adjusted to reflect a change, such as a merger, acquisition, dividend, etc. Check with your broker if you are unsure which one to buy. Although the symbol is usually a give away.

I will create a post on Vix options. Even with all this movement, the way they are priced is to your disadvantage. On our first conference call I mentioned how they are priced based on futures, not the underlying index. This ought to be a good post to clarify.


Michelle, I am glad to see you are back.

Thanks Jeff! Got it....



No crystal balls here...just alot of time spent analyzing...then deciding on risk vs. reward and postion sizing...

Did someone just shock GOOG back to life?

Did everyone buy GOOG when I told you to? When the market was selling off and GOOG was holding up?


I am a googling and CME ing baby...

Love this market..

SIGM has nice flag set up today. The options are so expensive, I may actually trade the stock. $32.50 has acted as resistance in the past, might be worth waiting for the break above before taking the trade.

It's good to see all the usuals still posting. Have a good weekend.

Joel R.

Just goes to show my newness to the game. I don't even know how to trade a cup and handle yet, and I am just getting a good handle on my position sizing.

Great trades by the way and congrats. You guys know I hope to be there with you, in time.

Maybee even by the time the PP is identified.

Thanks for the elaboration,


Are you still in any China plays? I've been stopped out of all mine over the past few days.


Looks like you've angered GRMN by insulting its knowledge of gravity. Right back to its trend line...unbelievable.



Missed you writing on the blog. How's the 30 acres with crickets (hopefully not as bad as Austin, TX)?

Okay, so... a lot of my positions are going the wrong way (not by much) or are barely moving the right way and yet, I'm making money even though earlier in the day when they were all doing what they were suppose to, I was losing money. I've never had that happen where according to what the stock is doing I should be losing money but I'm making money on the options. I've only heard people talk about this. Weird! But I'll take it.


C2 - WELCOME BACK ... We have missed you around here .... I continue to smile at your posts ...

Michelle ... glad to have you back as well ... Little turbulence to overcome but Romans 8:28 maa'm ..?)))

Doji ... I got into NVDA yesterday ... saw it as low risk (which in this market is high risk) but happy with the results today.

Raimo & Brett ... options were so cheap yesterday that I stuck my big toe into Google with a small experimental position ... I'm definitely happy with it today but if I was one that watches my account a lot, that price action on that sucker would cause heart attacks .... but we'll see ... I have my rules to follow on it and so far, it's within them.

GRMN ... I saw it drop ... Because of volatility and it went below my stop .. I dropped it like a lead banana (whatever that is!) ... but may get back in .... Now it looks like a hasty decision but better to follow those rules!

Congrats to you CME guys! WOW!

Yes, I am still in my China plays..

I know who the Phantom is.

I am loving GOOG and CME

And it is great to have Brett back on the blog blogging...


did you guys do the 4 day live?


I think my brain is a little sluggish today. I meant to welcome you back Michelle!



No, not yet. We're just now going to be taking the 3 day in Utah the beginning of August. We're a little behind from when we should have taken this. I've been told that most of it will be review as we'll be more ahead than most of the people taking the class. I think I'll be glad for the review though.


new thread....

Yeah, Michelle and congrats on talking it through. I was going to offer to trade with me as I have money but limited success. I see that I enter the trades at support but well after you all do and then when there is a correction I get crushed. Chris your outline is a perfect example as I was in most of those that were profitable for you and they were all for me too until they were stopped out at my emergency stop intraday as I was away from the computer. Chris did you have stops on your trades as I know you were away a lot too. If I had entered into the trade earlier I would have been ok. Like now I have no time to evaluate CME, GOOG, VSEA... so will probably be too late.

Can you believe it the cabinets are nearly done, whew! Just painting trim, you should see my hands...white paint everywhere.

Gotta run as more family coming over and more of the under 4 foot varity so will be guarding the wet paint!

Jeff and all this community is amazing and someday I want to have a down week like this and outline my trades like Chris did and have his results.

Would anybody consider LGF a good entry point for a short sell?



Awesome to have you back. You are an integral part of the family.

I heard that our Grand Pa Wilfred Brimley was going to stop doing Liberty Mutual commercials if you stopped trading.

Welcome back.


Mr. Raimo,

If you are not neck deep in a Yuengling and you have a moment, which Chineese plays are you in or watching?

My great idea was $XAU last week. Good thing I stayed away.


Did someone say Clean Cups?

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About me

  • I'm Option Addict
  • From Saratoga Springs, Utah, United States
  • I am a professional trader and an instructor for Investools. I've had relations with the markets for 9 years. Born in Concord, CA, but reside in Saratoga Springs, Utah. Father of THREE, Husband of one.
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